9/11 Truthers Are Not Holocaust Deniers
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I don’t understand the obsession that the debunkers have with trying to associate those who believe 9/11 was an inside job with those who deny the holocaust happened. I think this is done as a personal attack, designed to cut off any dialogue (or at least ensure that it descends into a flame war).
I also don’t understand why I personally have to prove that I don’t deny the holocaust happened.
Firstly, this is trying to disprove a negative. There’s a reason for the 5th Amendment in our legal system.
Secondly, those who denied the Holocaust (an official act of the German government carried out against the people of the country) overlooked the potential for their own government to do evil. I say “their own government” because most of these people were Germans that lived through the Nazi regime and didn’t catch on that something was awry. Those who don’t believe the official story of what happened on 9/11 don’t trust their government and do believe the government is capable of lying to them. Why is thinking a government could lie such a bad thing? They always have and they always will.
Hitchcock via Wikipedia
Thirdly, I’ve never met a single truther that actually denied the Holocaust. Maybe some exist, but I haven’t found running any of the thousands of websites I’ve personally visited in trying to develop my own understanding of the events that took place on 9/11. This is clearly just a tactic to shut people up and discourage them from speaking out. Most truthers I’ve met are compassionate, level-headed and intelligent people that can speak calmly one-on-one with others while they share their ideas. Debunkers, on the other hand, are a different bunch indeed. They attack us on our intellect, mental health, qualifications, affiliations or anything else just to tear us down.
Finally, I guess this will be the closest I’ll be able to get to proving to all of the debunkers that we aren’t Holocaust deniers. I actually found this unfinished Alfred Hitchcock documentary the other day while Stumbling (StumbleUpon) through videos. The footage is really incredible and shocking, so please don’t watch unless you are prepared to handle death, nudity, forced labor, starvation and the like. This is definitely NOT WORK SAFE. Please watch this documentary reverently and let your comments be respectful of their deaths. Also, don’t forget the hundreds of millions of other people that died at the hands of their own government in the 20th Century alone.
Again, please be respectful with your comments.
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If you have questions about Building 7, please visit:
http://www.911myths.com/html/wtc7___silverstein...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/researc...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/conspirac...
way to go with the off-topic comment
When a real government lead conspiracy starts killing people, the world will know. The Holocaust is an example of world indifference to undeniable fact.
Your conspiracies and belief in an evil government are based on conjecture, interesting video splicing, and frankly, way too much time.
1. I never said that you were a Holocaust denier.
2. I'm willing to concede that not all 911 truthers are Holocaust deniers.
3. I have much better arguments than accusing all truthers of being Holocaust deniers.
4. I'm not trying to cut off dialogue.
5. I never asked you to prove that you're not a Holocaust denier.
6. On “Thirdly, I’ve never met a single truther that actually denied the Holocaust” -
Apparently you're a holocaust denial denier. By way of example, Eric Hufschmid and Christopher Bollyn have been big players in the 911 truth movement (although their influence is a bit less nowadays, as Alex Jones has taken the spotlight). It is even the case that, on the original thread to this topic, Martin Timothy cited Christopher Bollyn. Here's a bit about that nutcase: http://911review.com/denial/holocaust.html
This is also informative on Bollyn and anti-Semitism among 911 deniers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB6nDk_FEBs
Also, I talked to that nutjob who holds cardboard signs up on Monroe Avenue (definitely truther horseshit, with some Alex Jones crap thrown in). I asked him about the Holocaust. He's certainly in denial.
7. On “Most truthers I’ve met are compassionate, level-headed and intelligent people that can speak calmly one-on-one with others while they share their ideas.” -
Yeah, unless you challenge them in some minor way on their bullshit. They instantly believe that you're part of the conspiracy, and that has consequences. As an example, I got stalked by a bag lady.
8. On “They attack us on our intellect, mental health, qualifications, affiliations or anything else just to tear us down” -
We also attack you on every single factual claim and every single attempt at analysis.
9. On “Again, please be respectful with your comments” -
Really? You claim that the Jews did 911, and perhaps that the FDNY was in on it as well, and you demand respect?
If you really want the truth, in addition to the “thousands” of unsourced conspiracy sites that you visit, you won't be afraid to visit the debunker sites, where EVERY SINGLE CLAIM that you truthers make is debunked. But I don't imagine that you'll do so.
Holocaust deniers are not saying that the Nazi's didn't do bad things to the Jewish people, but it didn't happen like it is written and presented, the claim that 6 million Jews were exterminated has been disputed and since governments are presenting the story, you have to wonder. After watching the history channel and searching on the web, my conclusion is that the Zionist put Hitler which was a Jew into power to bring about the state of Israel through this Holocaust. The name Holocaust & the amount 6 it self is significant, where as many other races of people that died in the millions were insignificant.
As for 9/11 I don't think the government had anything to do with it and I don't think you can compare it to WWII.
What happen to the Jewish people during WWII was evil weather the number was 6 million or 1, because humans don't deserve to be persecuted in such a manner, not even the people of Palestine, Africa, Mexico, Asia and all the other places
So you're not a Holocaust denier? You just believe Jews traded 6 million (and you even deny this number) for a shot at their own country?
Awful.
Just awful.
Well there you go - another silly goose who believes unsourced claims on the Internet.
Did the History Channel actually run with the Zionist angle as the cause of the Holocaust?
The Holocaust was so unbelievably documented.
Here's some good reading on the beginning of the Holocaust: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristallnacht
And yes, I know it's an Internet site, but (1) it's well-sourced, and you can go to the additional sources that such sources cite and (2) if you don't believe in the facts, you can present evidence to wikipedia that the facts are wrong.
I was trying to be polite with my point of view however not to be ugly but some of you some of you wish to be childish and not accept the fact or should I say just the facts you wish to believe, I'm sure you same people believe God created us and the Jewish are the chosen people.
Go hear my idol Huey P Long it will relax you
http://www.americanrhetoric.com/top100speechesa...
As an atheist I wholeheartedly agree with Paul and Common Sense's comments, nothing really to add here.
Anyway, that speech has no reference to the holocaust, so why bring it up? If you can post any evidence to your belief that the holocaust was created in order to create a Jewish state, please reference it.
You are so intellectually dishonest to say: “You claim that the Jews did 911, and perhaps that the FDNY was in on it as well, and you demand respect?”
I don't know where you come up with this but you seem to be continually projecting others' beliefs onto me.
Andrew, you seemed to write in the previously thread that the Israelis definitely had foreknowledge of 911. That's bullshit, of course, or, at least, 7 years later, there's no proof. I don't think you quite understand that, even if you don't have the disease of anti-Semitism, you're being manipulated by those who do.
As to the FDNY, you're right, you haven't explicitly blamed the FDNY (as some truthers have), the FDNY would NECESSARILY HAVE HAD TO HAVE BEEN INVOLVED in the conspiracy (including the bullshit about blowing up WTC 7). I don't think you've thought this out, Andrew. At least the truthers who claim the FDNY was behind the conspiracy are intellectually consistent - they're horrible people, of course.
Andrew, you've teamed up with a bunch of uneducated losers. Every stupid WTC 7 claim has been debunked. It's your choice.
I think this comment proves my point beautifully. “John” questions the story of the Holocaust but doesn't believe 9/11 was an inside job.
No, your point seemed to evolve into 911 truthers not being holocaust deniers. Surely there are holocaust deniers that are not truthers, and truthers that are not holocaust deniers, but it's somewhat silly to think that, after reading thousands of truther websites (apparently without having the courage to confront responses to truther claims), you've all but concluded that no truther is also a holocaust denier.
This is a problem I've had with your site from the beginning Andrew. It contains what I believe are a lot of unsubstantiated claims for a variety of issues. Now how can you be so offended if others make unsubstantiated comments about you and your opinions?
Objectively, your McCain supporter arrested thread was horribly dishonest. If you want to run a legitimate site, you should set the example by not posting unsubstantiated claims.
What ever happened to the naked lens? You were free to interpret what happened in that scene freely and you did. It was night tightly edited to make the McCain supporter look good or the Obama supporters look bad. It wasn't even constructed to make the police look bad. Their actions speak for themselves and you decided to interpret their actions differently than I did. I don't really see any dishonesty there. If you want to see a dishonest blog, head over to one of Michele Malkin's blogs (so-called pajamas media) and look at their claims. They claimed the video of the puppy that a Marine threw off the cliff was faked. It was not. It was later admitted by the Marines to be real. She hasn't retracted her statements.
Also, search take a look at Mike Reagan's talk show:
http://riseuprochester.org/2008/06/21/so-whats-...
http://riseuprochester.org/2008/06/21/mike-reag...
Take a look at what he's gotten away with. It might open your eyes a bit.
Using an obscure and undocumented site to attack the credibility of a site that is neither obscure nor undocumented doesn't help your argument very much
Goblin people? Right. You must have been watching one of those tightly-edited, out of context clips. Do you really think that Senators, Congressmen, Members of the Japanese Diet, Celebrities, CIA Chiefs and former members of the intelligence community would really go on a show like that?
Yes, goblin people.
As to more rational people that appear on Jones' show, they appear there because they are either so desperate that they'll take any media appearance or they don't know what a nut he is.
As you correctly point out, some celebrities do appear on his show. You seem to be making the “Argument from Charlie Sheen,” which is classic!
Now why does Alex have David Icke and other crazies on his show? Are you worried that lizard people are after you, Andrew?
And does the thought of Molech's minions coming after you keep you up at night? http://kr.youtube.com/watch?v=dtaPlBY1ylA
Yeah, Alex Jones is rational. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjfAVNcOSXE&feat...
I love how people like you think that no “tyrants” can control America! Like as if history defies that! Look at the facts, news articles from the past and you will see the criminality of the Bushes man. You will see the stark comparisons between Hitler's Reichstag and 9/11. Also the Bush's funding of the Nazi regime along with John D. Rockefeller's Standard Oil back in the 1930's. Freedom is not free. It is very difficult to keep intact if we just act like you and accept the way the corporate elite wants for it to be! Evil persists in “force” and not in power. Power is generally good for the people because it is much more exponential than force. Force is concentrated and attracts men and women of low morality as Einstein would say.
Sean,
You're probably insane - and to the state the obvious, you're stupid. You've become quite accustomed to running around campus talking about the Reichstag fire to people who know nothing of the of Reichstag fire. In this dumbass post, you think you accomplished something. No, you moron, you know nothing of Van der Lubbe and the fact that he acted alone and the fact that Hitler took advantage of a rather lucky moment.
Now when the Bush administration peacefully hands the keys over to the Obama administration in January, will you stop annoying people around town with your “Bush=Nazi” bullshit?
But, then, I know you moron truthers have targeted your stupidity at Obama; it's already starting up.
And you're just waiting for that charlatan Alex Jones to tell you what to think about Obama.
You've joined a cult, folks, and you're being increasingly marginalized.
You're laughable.
Obviously you do not look at Library of Congress documents and parallels to Oil and evil
So if some mental patient did it then why would Hindenburg issue a decree the next day: “for the Protection of the people and the State,” which stated: “Restrictions on personal liberty, on the right of free expression of opinion, including freedom of the press; on the rights of assembly and association; and violations of the privacy of postal, telegraphic and telephonic communications and warrants for house searches, orders for confiscations as well as restrictions on property, are also permissible beyond the legal limits otherwise prescribed.” ?
Why would you have to limit liberty, assembly and speech if it was some mentally ill person acting alone?
That argument proves nothing. Certainly Hitler took advantage of his dumb luck. But remember that there was still enough law & order left in Germany to allow Markov to present a defense and not be found guilty.
If you wish to argue that Bush took advantage of 911 just like Hitler took advantage of the Reichstag fire, then fine. I'd have a few issues with that, but that's a much better argument than the crap that Alex Jones spews and you parrot.
GOBLIN PEOPLE! GOBLIN PEOPLE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOc9mAZjQa8
Andrew, are you worried that eating GMO food will turn you into a goblin?
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